Outro: Welcome to the iWork4Him podcast. I'm Todd T. Reilly, producer of the iWork4Him radio program, the voice of the faith and work movement. Our mission is to transform the workplace of every Christian into a mission field. What does that look like in your workplace? Let's find out right now.

Jim: This episode of iWork4Him was previously recorded for the Christian Leadership Alliance's Outcomes Conference podcast, where leaders come to invest the best of what they know into other leaders.

Martha: Remember, if you have influence over just one person, you are a leader. Together, let's listen to this podcast and learn more about leading God's way.

Jim: We have an incredible conversation coming up today with Dr. Andy Westmoreland and Za'ndra Bishop with Faith Search Partners. You can find them online at faithsearchpartners. com. We'll be focused on how they lead and strive to create cultures of belonging, not only at Faith Search Partners, but in an organization that loves Jesus near you. Dr. Andy Westmoreland and Za'ndra Bishop, both senior VPs, welcome.

Za'ndra Bishop: Thank you.

Andy Westmoreland: Thanks, Jim and Martha.

Jim: All right, well, great. We're just grateful to have you guys here today.

Before we get started talking about your leadership roles and how you influence leadership roles through Faith Search Partners, Talk about how you keep your faith strong and your leadership Christ centered and your influence Christ centered. Za'ndra, you go first.

Za'ndra Bishop: Yeah. I think that, you know, it's a journey. I will tell you, I've had different phases of what that looks like, but number one, I'll say my community. That's kind of what guides me on a regular basis. I believe having that accountability person or whether it's my husband or whether it's my mother or my community at church, just being able to say, Hey, let me pray with you. Open up to me, you know, don't just isolate yourself.

And then I would say the other thing is just my time with God every single morning, every single afternoon. I truly believe in taking a pause throughout the day and being able to really reflect and really be able to kind of look up at myself and say, Hey, God, help me right now.

So I, that's kind of what keeps me grounded. And then I'll say the last thing, but it's actually one of the most important things for me is praise and worship. I am a big person about singing and dancing and, and I believe kind of letting the spirit shine. I'm not one of those Baptists, which I am Baptist, but I'm not one of those Baptists that shy away from dancing and just letting the spirit runs through me.

Martha: That's so good. So Andy, what about for you? What are some things that help you to keep your faith grounded and centered on Christ and all that you're doing in leadership?

Andy Westmoreland: Sure. Well, Martha, first, I want to say about about Za'ndra that actually she is Dr. Za'ndra Bishop. And so Jim and Martha, you really, you have a pair of docs here on your show today.

Martha I appreciate the question and I'm glad to throw in a nice word about Za'ndra and, and so I would say many of the same things that Za'ndra said, except I guess I would talk a little bit more about the having focused and a disciplined approach to prayer and beginning every day that way.

I do keep a list of, every day of the month, I've got a list of friends that I pray for on on that day of the month. Years ago when I was in university administration, I decided that I wanted to pray for all of our students and I recognized that every student had a birthday. And so it became part of my regular pattern to pray by name for our students on their birthday, and then send them a little, a little letter you know, later that day expressing hope for them and a bit of encouragement, but it's that active and disciplined and focused prayer life that I think has probably had the most impact on me over the years.

Martha: Wow. And the intentionality in taking that step, that wasn't easy, but I am guessing had huge impact on the students. I couldn't even imagine being told that you know, someone in your position was praying for me in that time.

Andy Westmoreland: It was easy and and it had far more impact on me than it had on the students.

Za'ndra Bishop: That's the natural gift of a prayer warrior right there.

Jim: That's right. And it is true. When you pray for other people, your heart gets shaped.

Za'ndra, my apologies. I didn't catch it. I just checked your bio. I missed the DM at the end. I apologize. Please forgive me. When somebody works hard to get a doctorate, you deserve to at least be called doctor once in the show because that's hard work. I hope God never asked me to do that.

Martha: So thank you for bringing that up.

Jim: Yes, thank you, Andy.

Martha: Za'ndra , I'd love to hear from you. As a leader, what are you, you know, what have been some keys to creating a culture of belonging that your team at Faith Search Partners experiences?

Za'ndra Bishop: Yeah, I would say number one is really having a purposeful, shared vision. One of the Most amazing things that I love is that we are all trying to develop and in regards to connecting and coaching individuals towards developing who God has them to be in his kingdom, and then connecting them with faith based organizations where they can thrive, right? But the other thing I would say is just the, like someone just being able to be authentic.

I think that that's one of the most key things about creating a culture of belonging is knowing that we don't all have to be the same. God didn't create us all the same. And really how can we be able to take that and build off of each other to be as great as we can be and love each other through our differences, right?

So I would say those are kind of the common things that I see that faith search partner does very well and our leadership really Strives to work intentionally to make sure we have a shared vision and that we move forward with authenticity.

Jim: So Andy, as a newly retired college president working with faith search partners, first of all Why did you choose faith search partners? Why do you think God led you there? Because Faith Search Partners is really an expert in the field of Finding phenomenal leaders that are Christ centered and plugging them into leadership positions across the country in Christ centered businesses and organizations and churches. You could have gone anywhere and been a president of a college again. Why faith search partners?

Okay, maybe not.

Martha: For those only listening, he's shaking his head.

Jim: Why faith search partners? And I want to answer that question first, then I can have a follow up on that.

Andy Westmoreland: Sure. Well fundamentally, it's the vision that Ed Fry, the president and founder, passed along to me. And look, I've been doing this, this work my entire professional career. And I recognized that all of these relationships that I have accumulated over the years, that it would not be good stewardship to just write those off and to go on. And then when I began to realize that the people that we would be helping to recruit and place in these positions would have impact for 10 and 20 and 30, and maybe in some cases 40 years, well, you just can't get anything more exciting than that.

And all of this for kingdom glory. And so I was, I was drawn to that whole understanding of what it is and what it can be.

Jim: So at faith search partners, you two are part of a team that helps shape the cultures of hundreds of organizations across the country. I mean, it's one thing to have influence over your own company's organization and creating culture, a belonging culture, but you guys have influence over creating a culture of belonging at hundreds of organizations by the people that you place, that you filter, put through and filter and prep, and then eventually place at organizations. Andy, that's a big honor. Also a big responsibility. How do you approach that?

Andy Westmoreland: Well, great question and I like to ask, as we begin the process with clients,

I like to ask the question: so what is the culture of your organization? And listen carefully to all of that, but then have the follow up questions: And what could your culture be with the right kind of leadership? And to kind of raise the stakes. We, we often, we often think that however things are, that's just the way they're going to be.

Well, that's not God's plan for us. That is so clearly indicated in scripture and then through the life of Christ. We're called to something better than we can imagine. And so I think it's important for organizations to not just look at what their culture is, but how it can be significantly improved.

Jim: But creating cultures of belonging is not an easy task and there's challenges. And when we come back, we're going to ask Za'ndra Bishop, Dr. Za'ndra Bishop, we're going to ask her this question: what are the challenges of creating a workplace culture, especially as you're placing somebody in to create that culture?

As we talk today with Dr. Za'ndra Bishop and Dr. Andy Westmoreland, and I'll never live that down, but stay tuned.

Break: Do you want to make an impact for the Kingdom of God without quitting your day job? Then here's some great news. God is calling you into full time ministry right where you are. The job that you hold, the work that you do, and the people you work with - none of that is by accident. Your workplace is your mission field. Change the way you think about faith and work by picking up a copy of our new book iWork4Him, by going to iWork4Him. com / bookstore. And remember, you aren't just working for yourself. You're working for the Lord!

Jim: Hey, welcome back. As we talk about creating a cultural belonging, our two guests today are from faith search partners. Faith Search Partners online at faithsearchpartners. com. We've got Dr. Andy Westmoreland and Dr. Za'ndra Bishop with us. Za'ndra specializes in working with non profits, medium and large non profits, and placing great leaders in those non profits to lead cultures, not only great cultures, but cultures of belonging.

And Dr. Andrew Westmoreland, Dr. Andy Westmoreland works with Christian colleges and universities to do the same thing. Za'ndra, Martha's got a question she wants to throw your way.

Martha: I do. So, you know, this is such an amazing position that you guys are in where you are not only impacting your own work culture and being a part of that, but the culture of so many organizations that you get involved with, with placement and getting people in there. So what are some of the challenges with this theme of belonging? What are some of the challenges that there are in creating a workplace where people do belong?

Za'ndra Bishop: Yeah, I think number one, from my experience, as well as just research, it really kind of dives back into the leader.

And the self awareness, to be honest, that's one of the key things, someone truly being able to take a step back and say, Hey, what are my insights? What am I bringing to the table? What type of culture am I bringing to my group? Right? Cause many people feed off of that energy. The other thing that I would say is with that is the consistency.

Of the investment in people. So, and I want to say in and with, because those are two different things, right? The big picture goes back to, we hear the words, diversity, inclusion, belonging, you know, those are things people have so many different definitions for them as well. And then we have the formal definition by SHRM, but the end result in regards to belonging, people still want to feel value.

They want to feel recognized. They want to feel appreciated. And in order to develop that culture of belonging, you really have to build constant, consistent, intentional building blocks of engagement. Now, what does that look like? Right? That may look like different things with different organizations and the people, but ultimately it still goes down to just getting to know the people you're talking to, not based off of what job responsibilities they have.

Of course, that's important for business outcomes. But really, who are you? Who are you beyond that role that you're taking? And I think that, those slow, what I say, "touches," kind of goes on to building that culture of belonging. It builds that community that we're trying to, and it also allows people to be seen.

I think many times, no matter what culture that you're in, people want to be seen. They want to be heard no matter how much money you bring in, or if you're new or if you're older generation or younger generation, if you're Hispanic or if you're Asian, they want to be seen. And I think that's kind of where leaders have to take that time and slow down a little bit more and really put that apart of their strategic plan to putting people first versus just looking at business outcomes and the revenue.

Jim: But when you look at the cultural diversity between generations, I mean, just even on this podcast. So we've got you, Za'ndra, from a younger generation and Andy from an older generation. We call it, we call us older generations "chronologically superior folks." There's the the idea behind shaping a culture there, but we have different ideas.

Because Andy grew up in a - cause I'm assuming his age, he's maybe a little older than we are - grew up in a culture where we don't really care what you think. Just do what you're told. And where the younger generations, they... oh, no, that's what our cultures were like.

Martha: It's generalization.

Jim: Generalization. Yes, of course. And, and then the younger generation is like, we want to make an impact. We don't want to wait till we're in our fifties to make an impact. We want to make an impact now. And we want to belong now. And we want to teach you chronologically superior folks the things that we know along the lines that chronologically superior folks want to teach the younger generation.

So there's, there's just going back and forth. So Andy, how do you deal with that? Because you guys are placing people that are going to direct culture. And you're in higher education, which is known to be a little stodgy and slow moving for change. I know that's not categorically true, but, eh, pretty close.

How do you do that, and how do you create that atmosphere to help ferment the diversity between generations? That was a terrible, terrible question, sorry.

Andy Westmoreland: No, no, you were right on. And let me let me answer from the perspective of an older person.

Martha: Chronologically superior, my friend.

Andy Westmoreland: And a chronologically superior person. And you know, if you want a good biblical text for this, go to Ecclesiastes 4:13 . "Better was a poor and wise youth than an old and foolish king who no longer knew how to take advice." You remember that one? Okay. Wow. Does that ever relate to what we're talking about right now?

Because regardless of how old you are, when you get to the point, That you're no longer taking advice. You're no longer listening. You're no longer learning. You're not engaged in in truly a a continuous approach to learning in your life, then I don't care how old you are. You're going to be irrelevant pretty soon.

And so you know, you can be 90, which is like two years older than I really am.

Jim: Oh, brother!

Andy Westmoreland: And still be relevant if you're if you're listening and if you're learning. And Za'ndra and I are now engaged in working together in three different searches. And it's been a delight for me to watch her and learn from her just just as you are doing Jim and Martha in this, in this podcast today. So I think that's that's that's the trick. Regardless of your age, we got to know how to take advice.

Za'ndra Bishop: And going back - just to add to that - going back to the belonging is knowing that we're more than just one factor, right? We're more than just our age. We're more than just that ethnicity piece and so, you know, Jim, one of the things that you brought up was You grew up in like, "get it done."

Well, that's how I grew up too. You know, I grew up with a single mother and she was like, "get it done." And so I think when we have all of those different elements, that's what makes us well rounded people, right? And that's what makes us so impactful to be able to lead and be able to build these faith based organizations that can impact the world. So I just want to make sure that we're definitely looking at what is the true wording of belonging and diversity and inclusion in order to make sure that we're all thriving.

Jim: There's just no question that as Christ followers, those words should be at the center of what we do because Jesus included everybody.

He didn't look at the different - he loved everybody. He didn't care about what the socioeconomic class they were from. He didn't care what the color of skin was. He just loved people and that was so important.

Let's do a little commercial because I want to do a little commercial for FaithSearchPartners. You guys work in different spots of expertise within FaithSearchPartners, but I personally know faith search partners. I have referred faith search partners to business leaders that I have influence over because I know of the power of placing somebody who truly is a follower of Jesus at the top of an organization.

Talk to me about what's the best referral for you guys. Because Faith Search Partners has really made an impact across the country. Za'ndra, share what's a good referral. What's the kind of case you want to work on?

Za'ndra Bishop: So you don't want to ask me that question because I'm probably very different from a lot of the leaders, but I like challenge cases.

I like organizations that have either have this problem that they're trying to solve a very brand new position or they have some gaps somewhere where they need us to come in and also assist them with some management consulting work and help coach them throughout the process. So I like challenge types of projects.

Of course, the easy ones, where they have a solid board, they have, you know, 20 million revenue budget. And, you know, their team is way to go. I mean, those are easy cases. We'd love to have those. And of course we can match those, but I love the challenge. I love to be able to help people see the potential in where they are and how we can grow them from there. Cause I feel like those are things that can be testimonies for other organizations.

Jim: Andy, what about you?

Andy Westmoreland: Yeah. You know, one of the things that I'm learning as a newbie in this field is the extent to which technology now really does work for you in helping to recruit new people into your organization and faith search partners has an amazing research team. And you know, time was you had a vacancy, you put it in a couple of trade publications and you kind of circulated the word around and then people responded or they didn't. Well what happens now in the search process is much more sophisticated and targeted using, using lots of information. And so I think that this is going to help our organizations to get better.

And I'm also like Za'ndra. I, I like a good challenge, too. And part of the process that we use through the assessment that we provide for our clients is to provide them with some almost consulting advice about things that we hear from their stakeholders that they may or may not be aware of that can really help them in their organization, and also in refining the search that is underway.

Jim: When we come back, lots more as we talk with Andy Westmoreland and Za'ndra Bishop from Faith Search Partners. Hang on.

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Jim: Hey, welcome back with Za'ndra Bishop and Andy Westmoreland, both of them from Faith Search Partners. If you're looking for a new leader within your organization or to replace a leader within your organization, whether you're a business, a church, or a Christian non profit, higher education, you need to check out faithsearchpartners. com. I personally endorse them because we have referred people to them and they do a great job. A great job. All right, Martha.

Martha: So we're talking about leadership and, you know, we all want to lean in and hear a little bit about other leaders.

So Za'ndra, let's start with you. What are a couple of core principles that guide you as a Christian leader?

Za'ndra Bishop: Yeah. So I would say the first one is really based off of a Bible verse to be honest. And maybe it's because I'm a female and maybe going picking on Jim a little bit, maybe because I'm considered quote unquote young, but at the same token, I would definitely say, you know, first Thessalonians 4:23 , which just tells me I'm enough, you know, because Christ I'm enough.

And with that, you know, one of my core principles is really just honing in and taking that time to understand who I want to be and who does God call me to be? And that's with that integrity, that's with that excellence. So that's kind of one of my number one. And then the second thing that I would say is really Proverbs 4:23, which is really focused on really guarding my heart.

You know, sometimes we guard everything else, but we don't really guard our heart and making sure what I put in and also be very careful of what comes out at times, but really being able to be humble. And that's what I'm saying is guarding my heart and having that gratitude is really, really core principle of me. In order to be able to lead appropriately and see people the way I would like them to see me to a certain degree and, and ultimately the way God sees me.

Martha: So Andy, what about you? What are a couple of core principles that guide you as a Christian leader?

Andy Westmoreland: Well, the the principles that I've talked with students about over the years tend to be confidence and humility, and Za'ndra began to address those in in her comments as well.

I used to speak only of humility because I don't really have a problem with the confidence part. You know, I do that pretty well. And so I guess I was preaching to myself over the years about the the value that comes from brokenness and, you know, and understanding you can't do it on your own.

And, you know, all of those things, that humility. And then I began to have conversations with, especially with students, who had problems the other way. They just, they got the humility thing. It was just that they didn't have the confidence to get out of bed in the morning and do what God called them to do.

And so I began to understand that it is in the tension between those two, between confidence and humility, and walking that line and I think they're each essential and so that's been it for me.

Jim: I love that. It's so good to just, I mean the humility thing. I mean we all need to be humiliated because that's what makes a great leader. That's just great. I mean, it's just so true.

All right, so Well, as we close out the podcast, here's the final question of the day. The Christian Leadership Alliance is a place where leaders come to invest the best of what they know in other leaders, whether those leaders are up and coming or those leaders are existing.

Dr. Za'ndra Bishop, what is one thing you would love to just espouse on this audience to just share your wisdom with this audience as a leader?

Za'ndra Bishop: Yeah, lots. But I would say the number one is I believe in like embracing that experimental mindset, which does not have to be cookie cutter. Try new things, jump in there, ask questions, discover, fail. And enjoy the process. I mean, those are kind of the simple things of that mindset. And I think that so many times we don't, we're not trying to experiment because we want everything to be perfect. And we say we want to be innovative, but we still don't want to experiment. So that curious mindset, that experimental mindset, that is one of the things that we definitely have to embrace.

Martha: So I'm curious how you've applied that in your position. Like, have you gone to companies and said, you know, think, I don't know, you tell me, what does that look like when you've had those conversations with a client?

Za'ndra Bishop: Yeah. So I will say, you know, with many clients, they're very hesitant and they're like, what do you mean? That's not a part of our plan right now. You know? So it's really that education piece really helping understand that. It's really small pieces of conversations that build that can be built into your strategic plan but I would say ultimately, As they're trusting you And they're having that relationship with you and you're showing proven ways that that can be embedded into Everyday situations and it's not too much of an investment of a leader or manager, Then they're more susceptible to say, I'll try it out.

And by them doing that and saying, okay, I'll try it out. That's already changing their mindset of having that experimental gauge. And knowing that even if, you know, we use the word failure, I really like to use the word " reorienting" the way we thought about things. We went out. We sought it. It did not go the way we originally planned it to go, but it doesn't mean it's necessarily failure. It's just another opportunity for us to pursue it in a different way.

Jim: It's not wrong. It's different. Andy, what about you? When you look in investing the best of what you know in the leaders that are listening to this podcast today, what's one thing you'd love to share with them?

Andy Westmoreland: I promise that Za'ndra and I did not coordinate this in any way, but, but here it is. It's a line that a mentor and pastor gave to me 40 years ago. And he said, never structure your life so that if God chooses to change things, it will make you uncomfortable. And when the guy said it 40 years ago, I had no idea how much impact that simple statement would have on me for so long, but it's true. And we do need to be open to change in our lives and in our organizations. And it's not necessarily a bad thing.

Jim: Don't structure your life so that... Say it again.

Andy Westmoreland: Never structure your life so that if God chooses to change things, it will make you uncomfortable.

Jim: Because God is going to change things. There's no way, no way in 40 years God didn't change things two, three, four, five, six times.

I mean, that's, that's good. We need to roll with the punches because yeah, we serve a living God and he wants to be able to guide our steps into the right places. While we could have, we could go on forever and ever and ever, but. Listen, audience, if you've ever thought about placing, you need help finding the next great leader.

It doesn't have to be your top leader in your organization. It could be one of the top leaders in your organization. Faith search partners could be your partner in this solution. And you've just met two of their top rung leaders that help people get placed in organizations. Thank you, Dr. Za'ndra Bishop and Dr. Andy Westmoreland for being on the podcast today.

Za'ndra Bishop: Thank you, Jim and Martha.

Jim: Thank you. It's been a lot of fun, za'ndra, thank you for keeping me on my toes.

Outro: Did you know that God has a calling on your life? It's true. He's called you to bring Jesus to the world. For some, that may look like a pulpit or a foreign mission field, but for most of us, it looks like a construction site, a cubicle, a hospital, or a classroom.

Wherever it is that you work, live, volunteer, and invest, that is your mission field. To learn more about integrating your faith into your work and retirement, check out our books. iWork4Him. She works for Him. Him and I retire for him by going to iWork4Him.com/bookstore.

Thanks for listening to the iWork4Him podcast with your host, Jim and Martha Brangenberg. Please visit iWork4Him.com to learn more about connecting your faith and work To join the iWork4Him Nation or subscribe to our weekly blog. You can also follow us on social media at iWork4Him to stay up to date and meet our guests. If today's message spoke to you, please subscribe, rate and review the show on your favorite podcast platform.

Your review will launch more workplace missionaries across America. That's at iWork4Him and online at iWork4Him. com. I work the number 4 him. com.