iRetire4Him Show 82: The Holy Spirit and Retirement - Why Do We Get It So Wrong About the Holy Spirit?
Intro: [00:00:00] While retirement is generally seen as a time of relaxation and self-focus, God calls us to love, serve, and help others for a lifetime. He has been preparing us for this retirement season, literally our entire lives. In retirement, countless Christians enter a state of spiritual dormancy not knowing how they are called to have an impact for God's kingdom.
The Retirement Reformation seeks to encourage and empower the 50 million Christians approaching or in retirement to embrace the calling God has been preparing in them. When the world says it's time to stop, you can begin to have your greatest impact. Welcome to iRetire4Him, the mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation, where our goal is to journey from retirement to reformation so you can say, iRetire4Him!
Jim: Reaching out to the 50 million Christ followers in America who are [00:01:00] approaching or already in retirement. You've tuned into iRetire4Him, the Voice and Resource of The Retirement Reformation. I'm your host, Jim Brangenberg, and of course, I'm joined by the founder of the Retirement Reformation, Bruce Bruinsma.
We invite you to check us out online Retirement Reformation.org and of course on our Facebook page, Retirement Reformation. Today we continue our three-part series entitled The Holy Spirit and Retirement. Because our retirement years can be years of explosive spiritual growth, even though our body may wear out and break down a little bit.
Our spirit is capable of growth and renewal. Christ followers in retirement can keep growing in wisdom and love and joy and other spiritual gifts. In fact, it's a fact that many of the world's greatest prayer warriors are retired folks. In fact, Retirement Reformation is dedicated to help you cultivate your relationship with the Lord in the fourth quarter of life.
In spite of changes, losses, chronic health conditions, our retirement years can bring about more quiet time to cultivate our relationship with God. Bruce Bruinsma [00:02:00] here today to talk about his spiritual walk in his fourth quarter of life and how his relationship with the Lord is expanding every day as he prepares to meet him one day.
Bruce, I can't wait to hear about your heart on this, what we talk about today: why do we get it so wrong about the Holy Spirit? That's our topic for today. Bruce, thanks for being with us.
Bruce: Always good to be with you, Jim, and this particular series is really very close to my heart. God's put it on my heart - well, the Holy Spirit.
Now, let me just stop right there. Okay. What I said was, God put it on my heart. Well, God through the Holy Spirit, put it on my heart, and we miss that connection. We somehow put God in a different category and Jesus in a different category, and then we ignore the Holy Spirit. In fact, God sent his son, his son asked the father to send the Holy Spirit.
So we have the wisdom of God and the availability of having [00:03:00] the Holy Spirit with us. You asked the question, why do we get it so wrong? I think the first reason is that we're just simply not aware. Many churches don't talk about it. There aren't very many books written. It's not part of anyone's conversation.
We'll use God or we'll use Jesus, but we won't use the Holy Spirit and we're missing A, we're missing the truth. And B, we're not then connected and with a, with an awareness. I'll give you an example. You know, six, seven months ago when I was diagnosed with prostate cancer and the first thing that the doctor said to me was that it had metastasized, and I've got two to five years to live.
Well, that didn't tie with what the Holy Spirit had been telling me for some time that you know, he's got a bunch of work for me to do until 104. So I'm, I was caught in this dilemma of the doctors saying, you got two [00:04:00] to five, Holy Spirit telling me you got to 104. What's true? Well, I came down on the side of I believe that was true, but there was a 10 day period between that meeting with the doctors and the tests to determine whether the cancer had metastasized or not.
And man, the prayer that was going up during those 10 days, that in fact, because the doctors have been very clear that they were very sure on all the external signs that it had metastasized. Well, I rested in my prayers on what the Holy Spirit had said, and from a world standpoint, miraculously it had not. I'm good, right? I've finished radiation treatments, I've gone through all kinds of things, but I'm I'm good. You know, God's word is true.
Jim: And the cancer did not [00:05:00] metastasize. I wanna make sure that we understand you're good because they were wrong.
Bruce: Because they were wrong. Yeah. And, and the Holy Spirit was right.
So awareness of, of the Holy Spirit, I think is one of the reasons why - the lack of awareness is - that we get it wrong. I think there's another reason that would be a cultural one is that, you know, talking to somebody called God is just crazy and is, you know, that's just you talking to yourself.
And so the saying that God does not exist, therefore the Holy Spirit does not exist. So denial and awareness are the two major reasons why we get it wrong. It plays itself out in lots of different ways.
Jim: Hmm. So is there support for a proper biblical understanding of the Holy Spirit in the local church?
Where can we find - I mean, let's talk about - we need to be able to enrich ourselves in the understanding, because I agree with you that [00:06:00] the Holy Spirit is our unfair advantage living in this earth. The Holy Spirit allows us access to the blueprints of heaven, to the storehouses of wisdom in heaven. Talk to us about how we can get a proper biblical understanding.
Bruce: Well, as we talked about in our last section, we went to the 14th and the 16th chapters of John. I just would urge our audience, if you wanna start someplace, for Pete's sake, please start there because Jesus is so clear. He also, in Luke, he talks about it.
So, you know, we start with not what the world says, not what any other outside expert says, but we start with the Bible. That's where we are challenged to continue to learn. Matter of fact, I thought it was interesting in our interview with Ted, he said, you know, when I asked him about, you know, how are you continuing to learn and grow?
And he immediately went to scripture. And so that's the place where in fact we do need to start, and if we go to 1 Corinthians 3, started [00:07:00] at 3:10. By the grace of God, by the grace God has given me, this is Paul talking in Corinthians. By the grace God has given me, I had a foundation as a wise builder and someone else is building on it.
But each one should build with care where no one can lay any, any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus. If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones or wood hay or straw, their work will be shown for what it is, cuz the day will bring it to light. And then in verse 16 he says, don't you know that you yourselves are God's temple and that God's spirit dwells in you? Wow - when you put that affirmation from Paul with what Jesus said, then you can't come to any other conclusion, but that [00:08:00] God's spirit is not only available to me, but is in me as my awareness increases, and I am able to connect with him and listen to what it is that he is saying through scripture, through circumstance, and through that direct connection in prayer with the Holy Spirit.
It's just, you know, it makes, it makes saying that I'm going to do nothing in retirement not the place to be.
Jim: Bruce, it's true that in retirement we have more quiet time, although I know a lot of busy retirees, but we do get more quiet that we don't have the push of getting to work every day. Maybe some of us are still working part-time, but we don't have that push. But isn't it essential in hearing what the Holy Spirit has to say? The nudges, the promptings, the thoughts that come into our head? It, we have to be quiet for some of that. The quiet time is really key to this, isn't it?
Bruce: Well, and quiet time is [00:09:00] probably two activities in it that, that the Holy Spirit uses to prompt our thinking. One is continuing to be in scripture, read the Bible, and then secondly is prayer. And as part of prayer, there's two parts to that. One is active supplication. The other one is being quiet and listening. And listening. And it's so hard for us. Matter of fact this morning our staff prayer time the person who was leading it asked a question and was looking for, you know, one of us to respond and nobody responded.
So we sat there for probably two minutes in complete silence. Man, that's hard to do, man. That's hard to do. And we need to be quiet and listen to what God is sharing us, sharing with us in that, in that quiet time.
Jim: When we come back [00:10:00] at our next segment, of course we've got a guest. And then in a third segment I wanna talk more deeply how the Retirement Reformation and how it can help us get a proper understanding of accessing the Holy Spirit in our retirement years. Cuz I know you've got some resources you're developing and I wanna tell everybody. And I also wanna make sure that we remind everybody to get signed up for the Recreating Retirement groups, especially the one that's online.
So we're gonna talk about that during the third segment. You're listening to iRetire4Him, the voice and the resource of the Retirement Reformation - you're listening to iRetire4Him and we'll be right back.
Break: Recreating Retirement is an interactive small group study helping you to move from nothing to what's next?
You can join us on Wednesdays at 6:00 PM East Coast time on Facebook Live. Our goal for this study is to provide a group setting for interaction and new ideas while leading you through a first step in your journey from retirement to reformation. Here's the big idea. During the next five [00:11:00] years, 5,000 small groups will experience this journey of discovery in churches and faith-based organizations across the country. Is your church a place where Recreating Retirement needs to be planted? Join us online to experience the study or prepare to lead a small group at your church or ministry. Email us at ContactUs@RetirementReformation.org or go to our website at RetirementReformation.org. That's Retirement Reformation.org.
Jim: Hey, welcome back to iRetire4Him. Bruce, every second segment of every show, we've always had a special guest join us to share their story. Who do you have for us today?
Bruce: Oh, thanks Jim. I'd like to introduce a friend, Richard Bergstrom. And Richard and his wife Leona give leadership to a ministry that deals with many of the issues that we deal with in Retirement Reformation. As a matter of fact, their first book, The Third Calling, just had a tremendous impact on me, and I've just appreciated their friendship and their support and encouragement that we want to give to them also. So, Richard, welcome. Give us a quick executive summary of how you [00:12:00] got to be where it is you are.
Richard Bergstrom: Well, I've just been following my calling through life. First years in vocational church ministry. And beyond that, since 1995, running a nonprofit - church health. And really when we talk about calling today, it was really kind of hitting a fork in the road where I resolved that I had a calling in life, but I wasn't finding an outlet for it so we created our own nonprofit organization and been operating under that since 1995, in and out of different roles at the same time.
Bruce: I just really appreciate all the work that you've done and your knowledge of the church and then the ministry that you've had with all the people that you've connected with about issues regarding retirement and calling and you know, third stages of life. What's probably the highlight of that for you when you think, [00:13:00] you go, oh man, when I had that conversation, or we had that experience, or we heard that, that just really impacted me? So what, what is it that has impacted you?
Richard Bergstrom: Well, I think it's been really processing how people end up in retirement and seeking to find you know, their meaning and purpose in that stage of life. And so much of the culture really dictates that retirement is all about leisure. And so as we hung out writing our book, Third Calling in Arizona, we observed people around us were having a great time playing golf and, and pickleball and all the things associated with retirement, but it caused us to really question what's the meaning and the purpose of this stage of life.
And so it's ironic that as we were writing our book, we were watching people around us just enjoying the good life of retirement, but asking the question, isn't there more to it than [00:14:00] just this? And indeed leaning into that, processing all of that wrote about that in our book. Third Calling.
Bruce: You did. And then I know you, you have a visual, a video series that you put together, and so you have really played out the callings of the Holy Spirit on your life as you've journeyed - as you and Leona are on the journey that you're on. So are you at the end of your journey or where are you in that?
Richard Bergstrom: No, we like to think that one's calling is a lifetime in duration. And we recognize that changes over time. But I go back to a quote from my alma mater Westmont College that we cited in our book. And it, it said that there's a calling on our lives. God has called us into his kingdom.
That's the first calling perhaps, and to be participants in his work in the world. Then it goes on to say it's the ongoing task [00:15:00] of every Christian to discern the shape of that calling through the various phases of life. And so when we talk about a third calling, we're not really talking about something that's different than the first stage or two of life, but recognizing that when one transitions out of their typical career or their profession or their jobs that they've done for years, they really enter into a new stage of life when they have to discern the shape of that calling for this next stage of life. And it may lack the formality and the structure that a vocational calling has for them, but it's now all about figuring out what's the meaning and the purpose of my life in this stage.
Bruce: Well, that meaning and purpose is what then gives us, you know, joy and freedom. And to be able to, to experience that and be able to have to do it with the fruits of the spirit being evident. The series that we're doing here has been on the Holy Spirit, and so [00:16:00] talk to me if you can, about how your journey with the Holy Spirit has taken shape.
Richard Bergstrom: Well, I think it's the spirit's role to first of all call you into the family of God. To gift you with spiritual gifts and to guide you, I guess, in the direction in which that leads you in life. And so we talk a lot about diving deep into an understanding not only of your spiritual gifts, but also of personality and, and strengths and motivations and all of those things that make up who we are. But it's all, you know, enlightened by the spirit and guided by the spirit. I guess just in terms of relying on God's direction to find that calling and exercise, that calling in your life.
Bruce: Yeah. That's a step of faith all by itself, isn't it? So you got another book in the hopper [00:17:00] by any chance?
Richard Bergstrom: Well, we do, you know as it relates to our calling. Our calling has really changed with COVID and everything that disrupted life in the last few years which is, is certainly true, I think of many of us that some of the activity of life has slowed or stopped. Some of the opportunities evaporated during covid. So we began to ask ourselves, what's our calling in this particular stage of our life and in this season?
And so we, we really pivoted like a lot of people had to do, pivoted to more of a research and reflection and writing ministry and in the process, It came up with the idea to write about our experience and others' experience through Covid.
So the book that's within weeks of being released is called Emerging: Boomers Speak Out about Life in and through the Pandemic. And, and so we tried to chronicle not only part of our own story but collecting stories [00:18:00] from our peers and trying to encourage them in the telling of their story to continue to follow what God has called to in this stage of life.
Bruce: Give me that title again.
Richard Bergstrom: Emerging: Boomers Speak Out about Life in and through the Pandemic. It'll be available on Amazon, well by Christmas at the latest we believe.
Bruce: Oh, very good. Well look forward to reading that and to be encouraged cuz certainly Covid has created a pivot for many of us.
Richard Bergstrom: That's Christmas 2022. I realize this might be a broadcast at a later date, and so it should be out by the time of this broadcast.
Bruce: It will be. That's great. Well, that's wonderful. Is there you know, as you look forward to the next stage of your and Leona's you know, life both together and, and in ministry? Is there, is there one particular challenge that's that comes out to you that you're working on to, Hey man, that's something we gotta pay attention to?[00:19:00]
Richard Bergstrom: I think for us the challenge is in discerning what do you do with this stage of your life? We have to create our own opportunities. People that are retired have discretionary time for leisure or travel if they have the resources to do that sort of thing. For us as we continue to seek to work in fun and fruitful ways. We enjoy work. We enjoy work at our own pace and our own place. And so the challenge that we face is continually trying to reinvent ourselves and figure out ways to contribute and give back to society at large and to the kingdom message.
Bruce: And well, you're just a wonderful example. How old are you, by the way? Just so our audience knows.
Richard Bergstrom: I will be 73 in January by the time this is broadcast. So yeah, we're just continuing to enjoy good health and our grandchildren and all the [00:20:00] good things that come with the seventies.
Bruce: You got another 20, 25 or more years, and we just want to thank you for the contributions that you've made to the kingdom in the various stages and the way that God is leading you and in this next stage.
And we just are thankful for your friendship, for your encouragement and for, you know, and for what it is that you have and are doing to represent Jesus to the world. So thank you for that.
Richard Bergstrom: Thank you.
Jim: Richard. I got one question before we let you go. What is the website if people wanna check you out online, what's your website?
Richard Bergstrom: Well, you can find us @Re-ignite.net. Like the T-mobile dash Re-ignite.net , or if all else fails, just RichardBergstrom.com. That'll get you right there.
Jim: Very good. Richard. Thanks for being on iRetire4Him today.
Richard Bergstrom: Thank you.
Bruce: Thanks, Richard. Best to Leona.
Jim: We'll be right back.
Break: Our work on this earth doesn't end when the paycheck stops. God calls us to be faithful for a lifetime. Whether you're looking forward to retirement or you're already [00:21:00] there, our all small group study Recreating Retirement will help you understand, engage, and activate what God has for you in this fourth quarter of life. Join Retirement Reformation founder Bruce Bruinsma as you consider your past, strengths, spiritual gifts, and your passions and how they all come together as the call God has for you in these years.
Connect with us on our online community group at Facebook.com/ Retirement Reformation. Wednesdays at 6:00 PM Eastern. Or if you'd like to bring Recreating Retirement to your church, email us at ContactUs@RetirementReformation.org. Are you ready to start your life-changing journey today?
Jim: Hey, welcome back to iRetire4Him. Boy, that was a great conversation with Richard Bergstrom. Bruce. I wanna be able to jump back into this conversation about how the Retirement Reformation can help us get a proper understanding of the Holy Spirit. You've got some resources available or that are gonna be available pretty soon. What, what? What do you got coming up?
Bruce: Well, you know, everything that we can do to [00:22:00] help people after they have that aha moment and go, yes, there is something. We can help provide pathways for them to explore with the power of the Holy Spirit to what it is that God is calling them to next. The newest thing that we have is, is a group study called Recreating Retirement.
And for many people, they have no idea about it or they got the wrong idea about it. And so it's important that we recreate it. And so, to be able to do that in a group study, we've got a virtual version of people from all over the country that are participating in that study. We're starting to have groups on a local basis.
Matter of fact, let me put a plug in. If you think that leading a group like that might be in your DNA and what God is calling you to do with other seniors in your church, please contact us because God's put on my heart, holy Spirit put on my heart that in fact, there's going to be 10,000 of these groups over the next [00:23:00] five years.
So, Recreating Retirement is one. Secondly is the, is the prayer calendar. Matter of fact, on our Facebook page, we've had a tremendous response to asking for that prayer calendar. Third, there's a prayer support app that can help you called Prayer Me that can help you in your prayer life. All kinds of other resources that are there, whether it be books or the podcast that we've done.
All of those are available. We now have a newsletter as well as blogs that are showing up, all different ways to be able to prompt you, and it's in those promptings where you can find the truth about your future.
Jim: Hmm. Wow. All right, so let's talk about those promptings, but at a different level. You know the Bible talks very specifically about the fruits of the spirit. What are the fruits of the spirit that are supposed to naturally flow out of every Christ [00:24:00] follower?
Bruce: Well, when we are in tune, when we are lined up, when we are in relationship with God and through the Holy Spirit, then he provides for us the promptings of how to deal with difficult issues in our life, with circumstances as they come, even with casual interactions.
So what are those? Well, you know, we certainly can talk about love as being the unity that everything else builds from, almost think about it as, as love in the center of a circle and in all these other activities or all these other fruit stem from that. So love is the unifying factor, but then love what? Joy, peace, patience, kindness, gentleness, [00:25:00] self-control. Oh my goodness. Those are what is available to us.
And, and just without a context, just think about those things and say, wow, man, wouldn't the world be better if all Christ followers evidenced the fruits of the spirit with each other, with their family, with their kids? I would say that that is definitely true.
Jim: That's for sure.
Bruce: Now these fruits of the spirit, let me just continue on with another piece to that, that God has, that the Holy Spirit has been kind enough to share with me, is that when we are faced with a challenge, what is the lens through which we can look to be able to represent Jesus and God's wisdom and his truth?
Can we bring to that situation? And so taking the fruits of the [00:26:00] spirit, which is evidenced in what we do and how we treat people and how we respond to challenges, but the lens through which we can look to be able to say: how should I think about this before I act on it? And that's a powerful, powerful thought.
Jim: How often though, is that? The fruits of the spirit: love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness, and self-control. Those things, it doesn't say, some people will get one or two of these, some people will get those. It says the fruit of the Holy Spirit. That means by naturally being filled with the Holy Spirit, these things will flow out of you.
So often those things get attributed, Bruce, to personality type. Well, I'm not a very loving person, or I'm not a very, you know, kind person. You know, like for me, my mercy gift is always needing to be refilled. So how do we deal with helping people understand that the fruit is something that's supposed to naturally flow out of every Christ follower? It's not related or [00:27:00] associated with your personality type.
Bruce: Well, when we accept Christ as our personal savior, what's one of the things that happened? We are a new creation, and it's in that change, that moment, that we are a new creation, that these fruits of the spirit become available to us. Now, it's not that we choose one and not another. They are all available and they all have value in different sets of circumstances. And so how do you learn how to deal with tough circumstances?
Well, first of all, you deal with tough circumstances. Then, when the circumstance comes up, you step back and you say, how would Jesus handle this? And then listen to the Holy Spirit and then act, rather than just blowing up and responding and saying stupid and dumb things, which is what we do all the time. But in [00:28:00] fact, to be guided by those fruits of the spirit, it's like, you know, it's like throwing that bowling ball down the alley.
And the fruits of the spirit are the bumpers on the side that even if you bump when you bump into it, he'll put you back on course. So I, I think of it as a compass.
Jim: All right. I got a couple quick questions for you before we close out the the show today. Which fruit of the spirit has the Holy Spirit been working on you the most to let it flow out? Like which one of those love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness, and self-control - which one of those is Spirit working on most in Bruce Bruinsma?
Bruce: Kindness and gentleness. Those have been the two. You know, I've got a pretty dominant personality and it's easy to be a little strong and that is a barrier to communication and relationships. And so to be able to back off and say, okay, am I evidencing gentleness? Am I evidencing kindness [00:29:00] in what I'm saying, what I'm thinking, and then what I'm doing? And, to again, remember that definition of the Holy Spirit. It's God's presence and being active in my life.
Jim: And finally, when a retired listener, when somebody that's involved with a Retirement Reformation gets this, and the fruits of the spirit start flowing out of their lives, how remarkable is their life?
Bruce: Oh yeah. The weight that is lifted from your shoulders when you deal with the issues of life representing those fruits of the spirit, it just takes this weight off and you're not worried about whether you're doing it perfectly or well. And God puts the words in your mouth that you can, that you can speak. Words of encouragement, words of love. Words [00:30:00] of loving admonition, all of those things. And for me to remember the gentleness and kindness part is absolutely critical.
Jim: Hmm. Great conversation, great encouragement. Part two of the Holy Spirit and Retirement. Part Three comes next week in our next podcast. Thanks, Bruce. Thank you very much.
You've been listening to iRetire4Him, the voice and resource of the Retirement Reformation with your host, Jim Brangenberg. Of course, the Retirement Reformations very own founder Bruce Bruinsma. We're Christ followers journeying from retirement to reformation so we can ultimately say iRetire4Him!
Outro: Thanks for listening to iRetire4Him with your hosts, Jim and Martha Brangenberg and Retirement Reformation founder Bruce Bruinsma. IRetire4Him is the mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation.
Most Christians tend to follow the world's pattern of rest and self pampering during retirement. [00:31:00] However, in your retirement, you can be focused on God's unique call to serve and help others. This can be your best season of life if you take advantage of a life's worth of knowledge and experience and combine it with a greater freedom of time and money, and invest it all in the generations both preceding and following you.
The Retirement Reformation is encouraging christians to find and follow God's call in all seasons and aspects of life, especially in retirement. Take time to sign the Manifesto at RetirementReformation.org and explore the wealth of resources available on our site. Join this movement of God and journey from Retirement to Reformation so you can say iRetire4Him! Go to Retirement Reformation.org.