Intro: Well, retirement is generally seen as a time of relaxation and self-focus God calls us to love, serve and help others for a lifetime. He has been preparing us for this retirement season, literally our entire lives. In retirement, countless Christians enter a state of spiritual dormancy, not knowing how they are called to have an impact for God's kingdom.

The retirement reformation seeks to encourage and empower the 50 million Christians approaching or in return. To embrace the calling. God has been preparing in them when the world says it's time to stop. You can begin to have your greatest impact. Welcome to iRetire4Him. The mouthpiece of the retirement reformation, where our goal is to journey from retirement to reformation.

So you can say, I retire for him

Jim: reaching out to the 50 million Christ followers in America who are approaching or already into retirement. You're our special people you've tuned into. iRetire4Him, the mouthpiece of the retirement reformation. You've got Bruce, Bruinsma been here, the founder of the retirement reformation, and I'm Jim Brangenberg, the host of the show.

We'd love for you to check us out. Online retirement, reformation.org, retirement, reformation dot R. So much stuff out there. So many resources, so many connections to help you figure out how you can live out your retirement with intentionality, Bruce, let's face it retirement as laid out in the American dream is just a plain and simple, boring.

How in the world can you spend 30 years watching TV, building puzzles, playing golf and tennis, going, shopping, and going on vacation. There's got to be more to life than just entertainment and pleasure. So many of you listening today have figured this out. You're thinking. I just want to go back to work today and iRetire4Him, Bruce and I are going to talk about what does it look like when we go back to work as a retiree?

How can we build out retirement reformation intentionality while going back to work? Whether we're going back to work for pay or as a volunteer? This discussion is based on chapter six in the book iRetire4Him found online. I worked for him.com forward slash bookstore, Bruce Bruinsma. But welcome back to I retired.

Bruce: Well, this, this last topic that we're going to cover is one that is really near and dear to my heart, because I just, I see so many people that at the place where they were the happiest, most effective witness, um, both received and gave the most was in their work. Now we often think that people are still working in those during those retirement years, during those senior years is because they didn't plan very well and they need the money.

And that may very well be the case for many, but I think there are also many who, and in, in the numbers that we see in the, in the news and everything, to the number of people that have retired because of COVID, there's X percentage of those. And I, I suspect it's a, a larger number than what we think. Who?

Yes, they retired, but they, they really miss the work environment. And they'd like to come back to it, whether it be the same place, but in, in some other environment, as a volunteer or as you say, get paid, but be able to come back. Cause that's where they find meaning and purpose and able to be a witness.

And so this whole idea of working. Uh, faith and work is continuing to evolve and, and taking on a different context for us. And so that's why within the context of what, what you wrote in some of the great lessons you have here for us are really important,

Jim: Bruce, since you've never stopped working this isn't really a discussion you can even have in your own mind because you've never stopped, although I'm sure you and Judy have talked about it.

Why haven't you ever stopped working? I mean, you never retired and then started working again. You just got.

Bruce: Well, the, we so firmly believe and have embraced the reformation of our mind that God has a call on our lives and that call continues to evolve. Sometimes there's a transition period between one part of the call and the next, and sometimes it's just taking the next step and in my particular life so far through age 80 plus, uh, it has been taking the next.

There's not a right or wrong with any of that. But when people say to me, you know, when are you going to retire? My, my somewhat glib answer is this. I already am. I'm doing what God wants me to do, where he wants me to do it with whom he wants me to do. And that's the best definition of retirement that I can find.

And if we could embrace that as a community and understand that part of that may very well be within the work environment.

Jim: That's an important insight that I missed one other part, and you're having a ball. You have a lot of fun with what you're doing. Yeah. So let's talk, let's focus this segment on those that want to go back to work, but as a volunteer, because.

So people don't need the money, but they really want to go do something. I think there's some things that people should consider, though. If they're going to go back to work as a volunteer and I'm going to get your perspective, but I want to share my perspective first, because as a volunteer, you go back into, you're gonna be subject to somebody.

But I recommend that you find a organization to volunteer with, whether it's a business, you could volunteer at a business. There's a lot, a lot of small business owners all over America that would love to have a volunteer employee. That's got your knowledge.

Bruce: Who's no question. Okay. If I can, if I can just interrupt that for a moment.

I saw a bid on some, some TV station the other day, where in fact there was a small business. And with COVID and all the challenges, they didn't have the adequate staff and they were going to have to go out of business. And as matter of fact, people have been, their customers realize that was true and five or six of them came and volunteered to be able to mop the floor.

One of them to be a short order cook one of them to be a waitress, one

of them to be agreed.

And they volunteered themselves because they, they felt that the, the value of that business to their community was so great. They wanted to be part of that. I just thought that was outstanding.

Jim: And that's the point behind volunteering.

You want to volunteer somewhere that you want to be, and with people that you want to be. And so my challenge to everybody listening is find an organization that you're passionate about. Maybe you had a job that you love, but you don't want to go. But there's a small business down the road that might need you.

Or maybe it's a nonprofit, that's got a mission that you're like, I want to help them succeed. I got a couple of recommendations. I want to make sure that you, before you plant yourself into an organization, check out their culture. Maybe you worked in a culture getting paid and it wasn't so pleasant. Well, there's plenty of unpleasant cultures out there.

There's no reason as a volunteer. You need to be involved in one of them. Choose your culture. Why. That's one thing, one of the things you think Bruce, that people should consider when they're choosing where to volunteer,

Bruce: let me go back to that culture. Let me a friend of mine gave me this phrase the other day and then reflecting on it.

I think it's exactly right. Culture trumps almost everything. Culture trumps almost everything. As a matter of fact, here, when we're thinking of hiring someone, it's a two-step process. First we stepped into and make sure that they understand our culture and that there is a, they are a fit for us. That's before we look at technical skill or ability or anything else.

So culture trumps just about everything so that that's so wise.

Jim: And my other recommendation is to plant yourself in an organization. That's got young people, as we've talked about in previous pod. You're there to mentor. Yes. You're there to accomplish something, to do a task of some sort or whatever it may be, or to manage people, but make sure you plant yourself inside of an organization that has young people, that you can pour your life into.

That's that's the game here. You get a chance to occupy your time and invest Jesus and other people through you. What do think about that, Bruce?

Bruce: Well, I think that's critically important. The matter of fact, in your book, in this particular channel, You talk about five steps of things that can be done, uh, while you are in that work environment or in that volunteer environment that will.

Uh, bring additional meaning and purpose and values.

Jim: So when we come back in segment three, let's talk about those five steps because we've got an incredible interview coming up with L D Dr. LD, Buckingham. We want to hear from him and we'll come back at seven three. We'll talk about those five steps. All right.

Sounds like a plan. Listen, and I retired for him. We'll be right back.

Break: Membership has its privileges and where the retirement reformation. It's true. We have three levels of membership to access our growing wealth of resources. We also provide discipleship and training to bring the retirement reformation alive in your life.

So join us, go to retirement, reformation.org and click on the membership tab. Choose the level of membership that will help you rethink retool, reframe and reform your retirement today. The basic level is free so you can get started today. Take the journey from retirement to reformation. So you can say iRetire4Him.

Retirement, reformation dot O R G. Let's get back to more. I retire for

him.

Jim: Hey, welcome back to, iRetire4Him, Bruce, as we always do in the second segment of every podcast, you bring it on a special guest in order to just hear what they're doing and their retirement. Bruce, who do you have for us today?

LD Buckingham: Well, today we have Dr. Buckingham and we have reached. In this conversation up into, uh, up into Canada. And, uh, I was introduced to Dr. Buckingham and a little bit of his history through an associate of mine here, Elliot Inness. And so Dr. Buckingham, welcome to the podcast.

Bruce: Give us just a brief overview of how God has led you to this stage of your.

LD Buckingham: Oh, I pastored the same church for 45 years. Took a little time, the church, 65 people and solid grow around a couple of thousand, which is huge for this part of the world. For many parts of the world is really not that big a deal. And, uh, I'm enjoying this stage of life. Uh, in every way you could possibly enjoy it until the fullest.

Uh, people will talk to me about this stage of life. And I say, look, this is not so bad. The kids are gone. The bills are paid and the dog is dead.

I never felt better in my life. I'm 82 years old. Never felt better in every way that you can feel good mentally, physically, and every other way. But I'll tell you what it's all to do with purpose. And I have people saying to me all the time, high enjoying retirement. Well, my answer is the best way to enjoy your retirement is not the right time.

Because life is not about pleasure. Life is about purpose. And when you have a purpose that you have a passion for, that is your pleasure. So I'm the happiest guy in the face of the earth because of my.

Bruce: Well, you know, between your forehead and mine, we can, uh, we can represent, uh, uh, the fact and Jim's, as a matter of fact, you know, I, I always get a little bit concerned when, when I, when I'm reading in scripture and that, you know, God knows every hair on your head and, and, uh, I'm thinking guy, he must be in a bit of a confusion right at the moment, but then he's never confused, but we know that, uh, that, that the term retirement is not in the.

And that, uh, having

meaning and purpose. Matter of fact, we say in the retirement reformation

that we are called to be faithful for a lifetime and that lifetime isn't over until it's over. And then we began very lifetime for eternity. So what are some of the kinds of things that you're doing now that, that when you put your feet on the floor in the morning and you think about the day, uh, that that encourages.

LD Buckingham: Well, I, I would say this to give a little bit of background a leader, as you know, it's got to be a learner. And the truth of matter is I have come to realize I've got to be working harder at learning today and have a greater curiosity today than ever before in my life, because I've got to unlearn a lot of things that no longer work in today's culture and read, learn what connection with the culture speaks, the language of the culture.

And one of my highest values is change. And I know that's not often the case with people, my stage of life, but I value change because of what change can produce as long as change, without compromise of the main message that needs to be propagated. And so. And so I am fully involved and engage in what's called the Buckingham leadership Institute, which is mentoring pastors, leadership conferences, church consultations, helping churches go on to the next level and doing all that I can in relation to all of that.

Bruce: When we, when we, when we connect with people who have, have gone through the transition from that first, what we'll call Korea. Into the second, which we second calling, uh, that, that transition

period is, is really for many people, a very hard one,

one that they're really, they really not connected that God really has a plan for the rest of their life.

Did you have any challenges when you went through, when you stepped out of the pulpit after those 45 years and into yeah,

LD Buckingham: I was tired and I didn't know as tired because I evolved into being tired. So I took up. And just did nothing. And some people would say, well, how you doing? I say, look, if I was doing anything to last, I'd be dead.

Y'all know, but that was all I needed was on month. That would do me a lifetime. And, uh, and, and so, uh, wanted to get back into it because of the fire that was burning, the vision that was burning the cause that was so important to me, my calling really, which was a, was a major factor, but here's an interesting thing.

I got reflecting on this whole. After retirement age, I'm talking after retirement age, I was still pastoring the church. We saw more house. After retirement age on all the years prior to retirement, I mean, we S we built a 2000 seat auditorium with a 1500, uh, space atrium and saw more baptisms, more lives, transformed, saw greater growth, and all that is important to seeing things go forward.

And so there's something to be said. I think for the experience, as long as we are innovative, we are creating. We are open to change and, and then, uh, we can be, uh, I think continue to be just as effective in fact, There's some ways that I can be more effective today than ever before, because I am speaking to churches that have missed generation after generation.

So you've got a lot of older people and I talked the way a 30 year old talks about a lot of stuff and they kind of have to take it from me. They look at the third year old, so he's wet behind the ears. He doesn't know what he's talking about, but they can't. And I say to them, You know what I'm talking about here.

It could be, even though you may not necessarily be all that excited, but it could be the greatest thing since sliced bread. And the truth of matter is I was truly around when they first started slicing bread. And that was a big deal. I mean, people went preserved. They were so excited about sliced bread.

Now I know it doesn't mean a whole lot to us now because we're used to it, but. Innovative and change can be the most exciting thing that can help people to have expectation anticipation and an energy you know, about going forward.

Bruce: No, it's definitely it's, it's the it's it's the energy comes from a passion and the passion comes from purpose

and purpose or meaning.

And when you pile those together, it definitely can be the most. One of the things that is, is really tragic and, and that you and I, uh, No need to continue to pray for and speak into is that there's in between

Canada and the U S there's probably around 40, 45 million Christ followers who are 65 and older,

and about

85% of them based upon our surveys.

When we ask them, what are you going to do in retirement? Come up

with some version of. And they're trying to make meaning out of leisure. Now leisure has some value, but it does not have meaning. And then we also know that loneliness is leading to all kinds of, of negative reactions of people. These age, speak into that for just a moment, if you would.

LD Buckingham: Hi. I heard about a guy that was fully retired and his wife said to him, uh, what are you gonna, what are you going to be doing? What are you doing? You said nothing. She said, that's what you did today, ACL, but I'm not finished yet. That doesn't have much. I can't get that excited about nothing, you know? And, and, uh, I think that everybody, even if you've had a dull, terrible job, you can find something to do that can, you can have a passion for, it may not be in relation to whatever job you have.

And I, and I knew before I finished at the church, I was going to need to continue to fulfill my call with every thing I could put into it. And, and I'm telling you, there's just no way under the sun, that things could be, uh, more fulfilling by doing nothing. It, this, I quit that, that that's no life Ms. Will be dead

Bruce: when you're, when you're doing nothing.

You are, your focus is inward upon yourself. And when we focus on ourselves, that's not where we find meaning

and purpose. God's calling us to love our neighbor. God's calling us to extend the capacities that he's given us to address the issues of the, of the poor and the widows and all of the scripture that, that lays that out for us.

Um, I think there's a picture there for us, but that we often miss. And so being a messenger of that picture is, is something that you're doing well. And we appreciate.

LD Buckingham: You probably focused on this a lot, but one of my greatest heroes in the Bible is old Caleb, and I just love his spirit. I am as well I'm today when it was 85 years old as I was 45 years ago.

And so as you look at Caleb, it really is so interesting. He had a faith that no matter how old he got did not waver, he had a strength, no matter how old he got the did not weak. And then he had a blessing for others that didn't get wasted.

Bruce: And to me, that is one great example for all doctor, I'm going to close our conversation with that great summary.

As a matter of fact, uh, what I'm committed to doing is I will memorize. The first two times I use it. I will give you credit the third it's mine, just so that you know,

LD Buckingham: well, let me tell you this, the guy that I stole it from didn't seem to mind.

Bruce: Well, God bless you. I'm so, so thankful that we've had an opportunity to meet and we look forward to, uh, to meeting again and, and being able to partner together in making a difference for those who can make a difference.

Jim: Dr. LD, Buckingham. Thanks for being an iRetire4Him today. We'll be right back with more conversation with Bruce and I talking about, iRetire4Him. We'll be right back. Every iRetire4Him. She'll go so quickly. We don't often get to remind you that there are two resources you should be checking out right now.

I recommend that you get a copy of the retirement reformation book and the, iRetire4Him. Book retirement reformation focuses on the mindset and behavioral changes needs. Well, let's just say paradigm shifting that is needed to live out your faith in retirement. iRetire4Him is focused on many of the ways you can put your faith into action by investing your life into others in your retirement years.

Get both@theretirementreformationwebsiteinthebookstoreretirementreformation.org. That's retirement, reformation.org. Hey, welcome back to I retire from great conversation with LD Buckingham here in his story, Bruce, right before at the end of segment one, we talked about these five steps that I wrote about, and iRetire4Him and it really intrigued you.

You liked these steps, so let's, let's talk about the five steps we should consider as we go to volunteer or even go back to work, to get paid in an.

Bruce: Yeah. When I came across this, in your book and that chapter, they got big highlights on each one of those five. Cause I thought they were so relevant. And so insightful.

The first one was just simply kind of like, go get to know the people you work alongside and you got to you think, well of course that you're going to do that. Well, no, you can do that intentionally to learn about who they are, not just what they do. So that was the first. The second one. And then we can talk about these, but look for ways to serve those around you in a way that your job description doesn't require you to do wow.

Does that open up all kinds of ideas of ways to be able to mentor and the conversation that we're having to serve and to demonstrate a, both a humble and a selfless attitude towards what you're doing, that it's not about you. It's about what are the needs of those that are around you? So I just thought that was, that was just so God honoring and I'll just hit the third and then you, and I can talk about it, but spend some time together outside of the work environment, away from the pressures of work, most people need to have lunch.

And I've found that what a wonderful way, just to say somebody, Hey, do you want to go grab a burger and get out of the office and just go sit down. And have a conversation, have an opportunity to get to know them. And in those mentoring opportunities be able to share we'll just arise and bubble up out of those, just very natural and relaxed opportunities.

But you need to be intentional about saying, Hey, let's go grab a burger.

Jim: Yeah. It's all about just really taking your faith and putting into action in your workplace. And then as you get to know people, you can look for ways to pray with people. When you notice they're having a rough day. If you work with people long enough, you know what their normal demeanor is so that when they come in and they're having a rough day, you can tell, but it doesn't matter.

None of those other things really matter. If your work isn't really demonstrated by excellence. And as a retiree choosing to go back to work, you get an opportunity to live with intention. You get to choose where you work. You get to choose the job that you want to apply for, and you get an opportunity to just do it awesomely and demonstrate that for us.

And that says a volunteer and, and choosing to volunteer. But we also need to go ahead, Bruce, but I want to make sure we talk about people that need to go back to work.

Bruce: Well, there, there is that, but you know, that, that opportunity to, to, to, to take a step into the lives of those of the people that are around you, because no one really wants to hear, hear what you have to say.

Until they know that you care. So to be able to find those ways to demonstrate. So for example, when I was saying in our last couple of minutes ago, you know, let's go get a burger. When you go get

a

burger, you have an opportunity to pray to you. Nothing more than to bless the food.

Jim: And you can say, and you can say, Hey, I'm all ready to pray for the food.

Is there anything else you want me to pray about for now?

Bruce: I pray for you for you have the opportunity to ask the waitress, by the way, what's your name? Okay. Listen. Uh, we have, uh, we have a practice of praying before we eat is what can we pray for you for? So you have an opportunity to demonstrate what it means to reach out to someone else.

So you have that, that those relationships that you're acknowledging. You're stepping into and you're having, uh, the beginnings of what mentoring actually looks like, know

Jim: Bruce, this, all of these points apply, whether you're going back into the organization in order to volunteer, or whether you need to go back and make some money because in today's world, Bruce, you know, you're a financial adviser.

Yeah. People need money. I mean, the cost of fuel is doubled. The cost of groceries is up 25 or 35%. Everything is sky high in home. Insurance went up 30% here in Florida this year because of some storms and fires in Colorado or something like that. Everything's gone up for prices. Some people are like, I need to make some extra money.

My health insurance keeps going up, but my social security doesn't or whatever it may be. We've got that ability to choose the, iRetire4Him, mentality and intentionality in choosing a job. But one of the things we also need to make sure is that we make sure that we plant ourselves in a culture that's healthy, but not to agree to kill ourselves for our work.

Most of us have already done that. We don't need you to that retirement. You still got to leave some time for some fun, right?

Bruce: Well, I've got someone who works for, uh, works with us here and, uh, let's see, I think he's 67. If I, if I remember correctly every day he wears a suit coat or jacket and a tie. He's the only one in the office.

Who's got a tie. He has a tie on every single day. At first, we kind of kidded him about the tie and now we will respect him for the commitment that he has to being professional, being

here, being loyal,

be caring about other people and worrying that tie is one of those signs. And so we have a, we have an opportunity to be a witness and to mentor in lots of different ways.

Jim: In that choosing of where to go back to work. It's not, it, there's nothing to be embarrassed about. It's okay to go back to work. And some of you will go back to work cause you have to go. Some of you go back to work cause you're just bored out of your mind, just choose carefully. And that's really what Bruce and I are trying to communicate in this last segment.

You've got an opportunity to be choosy and in today's world where there are 12 million jobs available, 12 million jobs available, you can go anywhere and do anything. You can work at a grocery store, you can work at a restaurant. You can work in a manufacturing plant, you can work selling cars. If they've got any to sell, I mean, you could go anywhere and do anything.

Everybody is asking for help. And, you know, They love people with gray hair or white hair or bald like Bruce and I, because they don't have to worry about us showing up for work. Right. Prose.

Bruce: Exactly. And, but one of the things that we are attempting to do here is to encourage you to be able to step into that role.

We know that it's a little scary, a little different. You're wondering, you know, gee, I don't know the technology. Will I be able to have all those self-doubt issues? And from Jim and my heart, both of us step into that. There, there are companies and ministries that need you and you need them

Jim: just imagine the impact on your own life.

If you get to pour your heart into people, stop being at home, get out of the. Go go invest yourself in a place that you can be passionate about. Wherever that may be. I got a brother-in-law who loves golf, but can't swing a club anymore, but he went and worked at a, in a golf, uh, a store, a golf store, just cause he thought that will be fun because he got to speak truth into people.

We get to be Jesus, wherever we go and you are desperately needed. And as we finish out this four-part conversation about the book iRetire4Him, just here from my heart as Martha and I put this book together with her dad, Ted. Our overall mission was to say, you are valuable. You are desperately needed.

Please pour your life into somebody else. You're not done until God calls you home. And that's when you know that you'll be done. But until then you get a chance to practice saying iRetire4Him each and every day. Right. Bruce,

Bruce: not only practice it, but pass it on.

Jim: I love that. You've been listening to, I retired.

The mouthpiece for the retirement reformation with your host, Jim Brangenberg, of course, the founder of the retirement reformation, Bruce Bruinsma. We're just a couple of Christ followers, journeying from retirement to reformation. So we can ultimately say iRetire4Him

or for him.

Outro: Thanks for listening to, iRetire4Him.

With your host, Jim and Martha Brangenberg and retirement reformation founder, Bruce Bruinsma book, iRetire4Him is the mouthpiece of retirement reformation. Most Christians tend to follow the world's pattern of rest and self pampering during retirement. However, in your retirement, you can be focused on God's unique call to love, serve and help others.

This can be your best season of life. If you take advantage of a life's work. Knowledge and experience and combine it with a greater freedom of time and more. And invest it all in the generations, both preceding and following you. The retirement reformation is encouraging Christians to find and follow God's call in all seasons and aspects of life, especially in retirement.

Take time to sign the manifesto@retirementreformation.org and explore the wealth of resources available on our site. Join this movement of God and journey from retirement to reformation. So you can say, iRetire4Him. Go to retirement, reformation dot O R G.